I have been attending CONduit for 20 years. My first one was CONduit 2. It was the only one where I didn't volunteer, run an event or serve on the committee. I have discovered that I am one of those people who can't work a con that I am attending in some way, otherwise I get bored. My official roles at CONduit have included; dealer, game master, panelist, performer, Fan Club Liaison, Print Shop Coordinator, and Gaming Chair. My unofficial roles have included; club member, gamer, costumer, filker, fan and friend. I deeply enjoy both my official and unofficial roles.
Unfortunately, I have watched my fannish home slowly wither over the years. Gradually the fan clubs, bigger dealers and out of town fans stopped coming. Some of this was due to the usual politics that happen when you get enough strong willed and demanding personalities in the same place. In other cases it was due to stagnation; seeing the same panels, costumes, product and hearing the same jokes or stories year after year. As fandom has changed the convention has not. This was even visible this year. Other than a few select panels and events, there were an awful lot of empty seats. Most of the dealers I spoke with didn't do very well this year, either.
This isn't just an issue with CONduit as an individual convention. With a few exceptions, the general sf conventions are all facing these problems. We are in the information age. Other than conventions like DragonCon, Fandemonium and a few others; the general sf con is aging itself out of existence. Fans can get a lot of what is provided at most general sf cons through the internet.
What CONduit needs to do is provide what can't be provided on the internet; guests that they really want to meet, commercial interests who will provide event specific items and a vibrant social atmosphere. The ice cream social and chocoholics are cute, but not exactly vibrant. The golden oldies of filk are fun, but the moon landing doesn't hold the same grip on the younger folks as it does the older. The young people love cosplay games, interactive entertainment like dances, and songs about World of Warcraft.
I saw some steps in that direction this year with the inclusion of several podcasts, performance art and two nerd rock bands. Unfortunately, the convention attendees weren't prepared for one of the rock bands. I was. Tri-Destiny is no longer the folksy, filkish singing trio that the old timers remember. They have evolved into a full-fledged Celtic rock band. Unlike many folks, I actually went to their website and listened to their newer stuff. The mass walk out of the old timers at the concert will not encourage such diversity of performance in the future.
On the guest front, the convention needs to be willing to pay speaking fees. Writers, actors, musicians and filmmakers who elicit enough interest in their fannish demographic will pay for themselves in additional memberships and other sales. The increased attendance can also pay off in increased participation in other events. You just have to be very selective about who you choose and what their demographic is. Someone who made a couple appearances in Star Trek won't cost much and will elicit interest from a fan demographic that we have always included in the convention base. Stephanie Meyers would cost too much and merely ruin the convention for everyone else. Her largely mundane fans will swarm her and ignore or damage the rest of the con. San Diego ComiCon learned that lesson.
The convention leadership has lost contact with the every-fan. Where does the every-fan get his fannish needs met when not at the convention or on the internet? That would be with their fan clubs. The Trek clubs have an absolutely thriving social scene. The gaming clubs regularly run events and games. The anime clubs even started their own "little" event, called Anime Bonzai. There are also a plethora of other clubs hosting events; Alpine Garrison of the 501st, the Rebel Legion, the Utah Browncoats, the Ghostbusters of Utah, the Utah Filk Organization, etc. (If I didn't list your club it's not intentional.) CONduit used to have a department head level position called Fan Club Liaison. This position hasn't been filled for years. It needs to be resurrected and filled with someone who is willing to spend a lot of their personal time attending fan events of all sorts. The convention needs to reach out to the fan base in the clubs.
I think we are reaching a point where decisions need to be made as to whether the convention will thrive and grow or wither and die. I want it to thrive. We don't need to eliminate the literary base of the convention to do this. We just need to be inclusive of the other aspects of fandom; truly inclusive. Telling people to participate than poo-pooing their ideas or interests is not inclusive.
Now, here's the other side of the coin. If you want something to happen at the convention you need to fight for it. DO NOT walk away at the first sign of confrontation. Show up to committee meetings in numbers (everything is a vote and numbers count) and make your demands heard. The old adage is true. The squeaky wheel gets the grease. If every fan I've heard express dislike of the way things are going and of individuals in leadership positions showed up to the meetings, the bums would be out and the convention direction would shift. So you unhappy people have yourselves to blame as much as the "old guard" that you hate. Don't let "tradition" hold you back. The fans are more important than any stuffy old tradition.
In closing. Change or die.
From Joe Milner on Facebook:
ReplyDelete"Now, here's the other side of the coin. If you want something to happen at the convention you need to fight for it. DO NOT walk away at the first sign of confrontation" I guess I just don't see the reason to fight for it. I can get what I want, (and an out of Utah experience as well) if I left and went to another con. The brief moment I was involved, my mind was blown at the rigid nature of those in charge and the fear of new ideas or suggestions. It seemed to me like everyone had their little island of power and guarded as such. I haven't been back since. The Phoenix con was the same weekend as this one, and (if I had the money, damn tuition!) I would have been there. My friends do the Mandalorian Mercs and they feel the same way I do. They went to the Phoenix con this last weekend. I think it is time for it to end. I hope that something rises from those ashes and becomes something better.
As a panel participant of Dragon*Con, they are no longer allowing even scientists or pro game writers like myself to be *guests* A-list only and they are neglecting the niche and the more tech and alt history tracks all together. Walk of Fame will be insane but panels will be hard pressed to get speakers and presetners as no one can get guest badges and panel particpant status has been done away with this year. This year we game writers, scientists and alt historians pay to share with our fans
ReplyDeleteI actually had a great time at the Con this year, but it was because I was involved very heavily with Filk. I had not been, I doubt I would have even attended Sunday. As has been true for years now there was just not a lot of stuff there that interested me, and most of it I had seen by Friday afternoon. There are things I enjoy and enter every year, I like the micro short story contest, and I like the miniature contest because it one of the few places that I can show off my mad painting skills. The art show is always good, but it seems to get smaller every year and the same hold true for the dealers room. As far as panels go out of three days of programing there were not more than four or five panels that I wanted to attend and most of those were filk. The panels frankly suck. It would be very nice to see, as Erin has suggested' more social things like say a Masquerade ball. I hope CONduit survives. I have been going since the second one myself and it has become an old friend. Right now however it is an old friend in need of an intervention.
ReplyDeleteAs I believe all comments should be open in this discusseion...
ReplyDeleteFrom Helge Moulding on Facebook:
Nerdwords
Hey, dude! Do you suppose it's helpful to snipe from the sidelines like that?
Some of us work our asses off. Anyone who wants to pitch in, they're welcome to. I know you volunteered a couple years back to run gaming. That's the only way the con keeps going. The sniping really doesn't help. Joe Milner responded to your post saying that people were rigid. Hell, sure we are. We're stiff and sore. We worked hard.
So I'm keeping my response *off* the board because I do *not* believe that negativity like that is helpful. I'm sorry to read that you didn't have a good time. I worked Thursday night, most of Friday, and all Sunday doing the not-so-fun stuff it takes to keep the con going. I still had fun.
My response to Helge Moulding on Facebook:
ReplyDeleteHon, read what I wrote. I have volunteered in some respect every year except one. I wrote that I saw some progress and then posted what I think could be done for more progress. I also chewed out the people who snipe and don't help. Sorry if you're feeling cranky today, but this is the shit being said in private rooms and needs to be aired openly.
"Fool me once, shame on you. Fool me twice, shame on me."
ReplyDeleteWe (fanclubs) have attended meetings in numbers. We have expressed our desires and concerns. We provided a 14 page list of them to CONduit leadership. We have also stated repeatedly that when we SEE change, we will reconsider our position.
Unfortunately NOT everything is decided by a vote. The dictum has been set that CONduit WILL NOT EVER pay a speaking fee or grant other consideration for guests. This one change would demonstrate a willingness to consider other options.
The fanclubs will not fight to be accepted. We have volunteered, held CONcom positions and seen well enough the internal machinations thereof. We are quite comfortable holding our own monthly events and have no need to expend effort to force our way in where we are unwelcome.
Your calls for change held my attention until you turned and blamed us for not doing more. Sorry, now it is the same old tune. If you want it, fight for it. Blah. Been there done that and moved on.
If CONduit is meant to survive, the powers that be will recognize the need for change and do something to attract those they have disenfranchised over the years. If not then I will mourn the loss and lay the fault at the feet of those short sighted madmen who think that they can change nothing and expect different results.
-Rex Rouviere
Rex, I am not blaming all of the clubs. I am blaming those that only complain in private or only at their own meetings and just meekly continued to attend or simply disappear without expressing their feelings. I am also blaming the individuals who aren't a part of the clubs that grumble in private or just disappear without a word. Too many people in our community are so afraid of confrontation or the possibility that they just might hurt someone's feelings.
ReplyDeleteI only wish that I hadn't been so caught up in my own club and gaming events that I really didn't notice how bad it had gotten. When I went to CONduit this weekend, I was deciding if I wanted to keep going or not. After seeing the successes and small changes that I did, I see CONduit is salvageable. I really want us to have a functional, even thriving, general sf con in Salt Lake. The hitch here, does CONduit want to be salvaged?
I will be attending the June concom meeting where they discuss the past con and step into organizing the next con. During their Kudos phase, I praise them on the things that went well. I will also, at the risk of losing some friends, step up and express my desires for the future of CONduit. If I have to hang my neck out there in the open, by myself, I will. If CONduit proves to me at that meeting that there is no desire for the convention to be salvaged, then I will have said my piece and will walk openly away.
"As fandom has changed the convention has not."
ReplyDeleteI suggested last year to bring Stephenie Meyers. ^_^
"...the general sf conventions are all facing these problems."
ReplyDeleteIt's not new. Go back 50 years, and you'll read Isaac Asimov complaining that the cons are getting gray and same-old-same-old programming. I'm thinking it's a bit like publishing a magazine: you try to bring in new articles, but, since you're Better Homes and Gardens, your subject matter is a bit constrained, and eventually you are going to be recycling that "Where to plant petunias" article you ran a couple of years ago.
"The mass walk out of the old timers at the concert will not encourage such diversity of performance in the future."
ReplyDeleteI didn't hear TD. I really enjoyed that rock filk band that played Saturday evening in the consuite. I enjoyed it even though the bass was far too loud. I came in late because I was curious what all that booming noise was, and I stayed because the lyrics and the patter between the numbers were fun to listen to.
"...the convention needs to be willing to pay speaking fees..."
ReplyDeleteBeing just one of the hoi polloi, I am not speaking for the folks currently in charge, nor for any of the trustees, nor as someone who has any kind of voting sway, but I think if you can put us in contact with any convention that is comparable to us in market, size, and cost, and that does pay speaking fees, we'd like to hear about them.
I find it hard to believe that it is possible to do pay speaking fees without a) going bankrupt double-quick, and b) alienating all of the loyal supporting professionals who you have not been paying speaking fees.
When I went in to listen to Tri-Destiny, I noticed that the room was almost empty. When I later asked some folk who were there why, they informed me that the room cleared out during the group's first song. The rock filk band was called Cyclops Kid. I unfortunately missed their concert. Though I did get their CD.
ReplyDeleteAs far the panels go... Here's the thing, we don't have a constrained subject matter. Speculative fiction, by it's very nature, isn't constrained. There really isn't a sacred cow that isn't made into hamburger somewhere in speculative fiction. There are always new works coming out that can be taken apart. Also, any current concern or issue can be addressed through the language of speculative fiction. Heck, the first televised interracial kiss was on Star Trek.
Who would ever expect politically hot issues to be addressed at CONduit? They were this year. Spousal abuse was discussed using the language of vampire fiction, with a standing room only crowd. Gay rights was addressed using filk music and nobody walked out. The very origins of the Judeo-Christian world was openly discussed in some of the archaeology panels. More of these types of things can be cycled through.
Unless a panel has large attendance year after year, we might want to put a specific panel on an every 3-4 year rotation.
"CONduit used to have a department head level position called Fan Club Liaison."
ReplyDeleteIt still exists. Never went away. If someone were to come to any of our concom meetings to announce they wanted that position, they'd have it in a flash.
"Telling people to participate than poo-pooing their ideas or interests is not inclusive."
ReplyDeleteYou're right, that's not good. I recall there was the time I suggested we invite Stephenie Meyers. No, I'm serious, I did, and I've not read a single one of her books. People suggest all kinds of stuff, and maybe sometimes you'll disagree with those suggestions. I hope the disagreement doesn't amount to "poo-pooing an idea," but, as someone from MountainCon once pointed out to me in a very similar discussion, it's not possible to make everyone happy.
No, you can't please all of the people all of the time. You can please most of the people most of the time. The problem here is the fact that most of the people aren't pleased, they just don't have any other local choices. CONduit needs to do something about member retention and attraction. There are fewer people in the halls, fewer solid dealers, and fewer artists every year.
ReplyDeleteSpeaking of MountainCon. It was the closest thing we had to an option. Unfortunately, it has been badly damaged by a terrible confluence of bad luck and bad decisions. I really liked MountainCon and would love to see it come back.
"Who would ever expect politically hot issues to be addressed at CONduit?"
ReplyDeleteI would, actually.
But I also figure we'll end up with our versions of planting petunias. It's part of the territory of running a convention that has around sixty hours of programming, and it's not necessarily a bad idea. For example, this year was the fourth or fifth year in a row that we invited the U of U machinima team back to show us what they've done. Yes: we had someone come and show us their homework.
It was homework that won an award at Sundance, but it was still homework. ^_^ Bonus: the guys who showed up wore their steampunk costumes. It's not as if they didn't know how to fit in.
So we'll probably want to plant those petunias again next year.
"CONduit needs to do something about member retention and attraction. There are fewer people in the halls, fewer solid dealers, and fewer artists every year."
ReplyDeleteI won't argue that good numbers aren't nice. I will point out that this year's numbers look like they were better than last year's, and last year's were better than the year before.
We'll call it recession recovery, OK?
This part of the discussion puts me in mind of that line from "Shakespeare in Love": "I don't know. It's a miracle."
Our best year, ever, in terms of attendance, was the year we invited Terry Brooks, who just happened to be coming out with the novelization of Phantom Menace that year. We certainly didn't plan that, and I suspect that if we had tried to plan it, then it wouldn't have worked. Our market just is not the kind of market where a major author kicks off a major book.
This coming year's guest is already picked: Tamora Pierce. She's a favorite among YA readers. Will she have a movie deal to talk about? I doubt it, although I'll bet she'd have done a much better job than whoever wrote the script to "The Last Airbender."
These things can't be controlled. So we go with what fortune offers. Everything else is gravy.
A few thoughts...that apparently won't fit in one post, so I'm splitting them...
ReplyDeleteFirst, thanks for posting. While I might not agree with everything, I truly appreciate those who speak up and express what's on their minds.
Second, 'splainin'. Others can argue both sides of the speakers fee issue far better than I, but as one who tried really hard to make a Masquerade Ball happen a couple of years ago, I can speak to why it didn't. Biggest reason is expense. Hotel will not allow dances unless a dance floor is put down. Getting the hotel to put down a dance floor costs over a thousand dollars. With the convention struggling just to cover guest airfare and convention space, that does not fit in the budget. Second big reason is the time. Hotel requires at least two hours to set the dance floor (pref. three) and another two (pref. three) to pick it up after the dance. Dance requires large space, which would be offline for 4-6 hours, plus the duration of the dance. Getting any group(s) to sacrifice that much space for that much time was (for me, at least) a dead end. If I can find ways around those two issues, I'll try again, but so far no dice.
Some good things that have gone away were shelved due to budgetary constraints (the convention's and those running said events). I hope they'll return when/if things stabilize economically.
It's like the Aesop's fable about the man, the boy, and their donkey. You can't ever please everyone, and will lose what you started with in trying. That's not to say things couldn't use a facelift, or that people shouldn't try to make improvements. Things could, and people should. CONduit (from what I've heard--my involvement only spans one decade) was started by fans, for fans, and people have gotten so caught up in just keeping it alive that some of the fannish fun is lost.
As Helge and Erin pointed out, we work our butts off. We are volunteers. Most of us sink several hundred of our own money and many hours of our time into the convention each year. With that kind of investment of personal time and resources, of _course_ people are going to focus on the things they enjoy most, which, yes, is sometimes at the expense of other equally worthy aspects of fandom. Is all the expense and effort required to make the convention happen worth it? Shrug. Sometimes. I do it because Joe does it. If he didn't, I would've moved on to other activities years ago.
It's a bit of a Catch-22. With a wider variety of guests and events, we could probably draw more attendees and get a more rockin' event going on. We need more attendees in order to be able to afford the wider variety of guests and events. Lacking the resources to afford more guests and events, we aren't drawing more attendees. :-/
(cont'd.)
(cont'd.)
ReplyDeleteSide note, this is minor, but regarding Tri-Destiny, I love the group. I love their music, new and old. But I was among the mass walk-out, because their bass was turned up so freakin' loud that being in the same room as the amplifiers was causing me physical pain. I enjoyed their concert very much--from two rooms away. (Rev Mayhem actually adjusted volume to suit available space, and I very thoroughly enjoyed the portion of their concert that I was able to attend.)
I'm all for bringing good, constructive change to the convention. As has been noted, some gradual changes are starting, and some will take hold and grow. But budget restraints must be considered.
Could we perhaps brainstorm some _cheap_ ways to bring a more social atmosphere and some more vibrant events to the convention? It needs to happen if the convention is going to draw a new generation of attendees, but even Anime Banzai started small-and-cheap. They just nailed the social atmosphere and started drawing the crowds they needed, in order to afford the variety of guests and fancier events that they have now. Events I recall from early-Anime-Banzai that drew crowds and might be adaptable to a general interest con: they had an in-character social/dating-game where everyone came as their favorite anime character and could participate in the game or watch and socialize on the sidelines, then there were some trivia games specific to series that were really popular at the time, and there was one in which people could call out different names of characters and figure out how they'd match up in some ultimate combat thing. One MountainCon event that was crowded and tremendous fun was Rex's Firefly trivia game. Firefly still has a strong cult following, and I would LOVE to see a Firefly trivia game at CONduit. Shrug. Do you think events along those lines might help? I think that, with convention planning as with dieting, gradual changes that people can stick to and build upon are more sustainable than immediate, drastic changes. Thoughts, ideas? I do not have time or energy to be fan club liaison, but I would be willing to speak with 2012's programming chair and try to start a track of sociable, just-for-fun, fan-friendly events.
Heather
Ideas:
ReplyDeleteOrganized cosplay events. I think Darth Vader, the 11th Doctor, and Mal Reynolds having a chat would be funny. Reboot Starbuck and old Starbuck meeting anyone?
Karaoke with nerdy songs on the list.
Live readings of some of the more popular web-comics with random people being picked out of the audience to play the different parts. I bet Howard would let us use Schlock.
Trivia games of any kind. Nerds love trivia.
Late night Rocky Horror screening with performers. Most of the folks who do the show at the Tower are fannish sorts.
Scavenger hunts.
MountainCon had their quest givers. (With very visible WoW styled question mark head gear.) The kids loved that.
Just a thought here.
ReplyDeleteLooks like alot of the issues we're having are money related and possibly venue related.
If folks are willing to change, to add more attractive guests/events etc. We need to look at more advertising options, and how to raise some money.
The cycle of we need more and more well known guests or bigger events to attract people v.s. needing to sell more memberships to get the guests/do the events is a vicious horrid cycle.
So what can we do to fix it or at least add to it?. Sounds like we need to do some fund raisers and we need to do fundraisers that will get us money from people/places who are part of the mundane crowd rather then the people who will be A) comming to CONduit anyway, and B) who are already putting their own money into the con.
Things we could possibly do
A)Fireworks booths and Snow Shacks
B)Concerts
C)Auctions
D)Craft/BakeSales
Julia also tells the story about how one year in CONduit's history almost bankrupted the con in it's infancy and the response was to do a series of minicons which saved it.
Maybe if we did a few of those that specificly showcased some of the clubs individual interests like say...
Mini filkcon
Mini Startrek Con
Mini Browncoats Con
Mini Paranormal con
Mini Gaming Con
It would be a way to reconnect with those clubs, show CONduit's support of their niche interest while simultaneously earning some slush for CONduit which in turn would allow for the shiny new guests and such, and would with luck also increase membership.
like I said, just a few thoughts.
IF the problems CON is having are Truely all financial and not a lack of will or desire by the convention planners then doing a mass focus on increasing our fundage would solve that problem.
In addition if it is too expensive in both time and money for a dance floor for social items maybe we should look at changing to a venue which already has facilities for such events, like say a ballroom with hard floors so that there wouldn't be an 'extra' fee for a floor to be put down.
P.S. - The last comment was from Dawnya Thill but the silly computer won't let me sign in cuz my gremlins are acting up :P
ReplyDeleteIt’s interesting to be the fly on the wall and note regional differences.... For example, here in the northwest, pretty much every con does a dance... some every night of the con. The hotels don't lie down and pick up a floor, as far as I can tell. If one is set up, it’s there for the duration of the convention....
ReplyDeleteAnd, Firefly trivia? The very active local Browncoats do that regularly. Firefly activities are alive and well in the NW, and we see a lot of their participation at every convention (there are many in the NW).
We don't have too much in the way of bellydance... a few panels only. And, while filkers make sure that there is filk at any con we attend, it isn't as strongly supported here at the local cons (in fact, the Norwescon folks "gave" the filkers in the NW their own convention, so that they would basically leave Norwescon alone)....
All that being said, the conventions in the NW all face the same issues as mentioned above. I think it’s just a product of human nature. I see the same panel ideas, recycled, at just about every convention. I see the same panels come up that I programmed for ConDuit all those years ago. And, local and regional conventions ALWAYS have the struggle with the same panelists being used year after year.... that's because it is a regional or local convention. You can't pay to bring in all new pro's from afar, and so you make use of the local talent - plus, the local pro's use every convention they go to do promote themselves - most especially their home conventions. It’s part of their job. It’s kind of like the publish or die aspects of academia. They have to keep their exposure going, or they fade.
And, the #1 biggest commonality I see *everywhere*? Fen complaining about the very same things....
[cont...]
[cont...]
ReplyDeleteIt’s a shame that Rex is having to sing the same song for so many years. It’s a shame that there is con politics. It’s a shame that budgets don't allow more flexibility. It’s a shame that so many have been made to feel unwanted over the years. It happens out here, too. There is a graveyard of burned-out fen. New blood is hard to come by - and raising the next generation is a bit slow for the need.
But, the reality of it is that there is enough material worthy of criticism on both sides of these same old arguments. It’s like what we always have to repeat for our children... someone has to be the one to set aside offense, pride, etc. for anything to change; and they can't just go back to old habits when others don't comply.
I'm sure I'll be long in my grave, and con politics will unfortunately still be around, with people making the same old complaints.
Those that wish to put for the effort, generally do so because they love what they are doing. Con runners generally love the work (even though we complain all the time... we often aren't satisfied with just being a convention attendee).
And, the old saying really is true... you get out of something what you put into it. You can't expect others to entertain you (at least not at volunteer wages). We build the stage, and we are the players that act upon it. Most of those we invite to praise and laud started out as one of us, too (Patricia Briggs reminds us of that all the time). When the reward is no longer self-inherent for us, we move on to other things. That's just the way it rolls.
So, the bottom line is, ConDuit isn't unique in what it’s going through. The struggles to break even, the resistance to paying speaking fees, the dealers complaining about too few sales (or the scarcity of dealers) is going around.
Maybe we, those who put on the show, need to reinvent ourselves to regain the fresh popularity that cons once had. Maybe those who don't will fade. Or maybe, they won't.
I do know that if a convention can't attract new blood to run the thing, it will stagnate and die. If the leadership of a convention discourages new folk, they'll leave and go do something else - and their energy will make whatever they do successful, and the convention will lose in the long run.
I've rambled on enough... but I thought I'd share some of what I've been seeing at the macro level, of late....
Oh, and please do lend your support to Spokane's WorldCon bid (2015) :-) We'll show everyone a good time!
Hugs (we miss you all)
Randy [Mac Kay]
Thanks for the event ideas! I'm copying them into a list that I'll bring up with 2012's programming chair, as soon as he/she is elected.
ReplyDeleteI like the fund-raising ideas, as well. If we could get a mini-con or two going over the summer, when we could maybe use a park with pavilions for our primary venue, then we could probably make back more in memberships than we'd lose on venue-reservations. Olympus Hills Park and Hidden Valley Park both have quite nice pavilions that can be reserved. What do you guys think? Provided it's held during pleasant weather, would you attend a fannish event at a park? If so, what events would you like to see there? I'd be willing to do my homework and put on some how-to-make-your-own-[fill in universe-appropriate costume or accessory] events. For Firefly, I could do a pretty decent trivia contest (though not as gloriously in-depth and diverse as one by Rex and/or Utah Browncoats would be...would probably be better to recruit them, if they're interested...). Anyway...love the ideas and will try to make some of them happen before the 2012 event.
Heather
I've been away for a few years.
ReplyDeleteI was back this year.
I tell people I attended the con.
"We have a Con?"
"What's a Con?"
"What's the point?"
The only ones that had heard of it saw someone named "big buda" review it on TV. But they at least thought it sounded interesting.
Erin, thanks for hosting this discussion. You are right, it needs to be brought out into the open. I've got many thoughts so I'll try not to ramble. Some of the big items may have their own post.
ReplyDeleteI don't think that all SF conventions are dying. Starfest has been growing for years. Also new cons are coming out labeled as ComicCons/Comic Expos/Comic Fests. Perhaps we need a Utah Comic Expo to start up. Late June would make a good time for a con.
Seeing something unique at a convention is a MAJOR attraction for me. There are a lot of items that are not found on the internet that can be seen at a convention. We tried to run a Con Museum at a past Mountain-Con where people could show off rare collectibles. Getting the Arial Ambulance from Firefly helped towards this (what other real or fan made items can be put on display?) The model display (think art show with only models) at Starfest is a huge attraction. Fans bring SF themed cars (Time Traveling Delorians, Ghostbuster vehicles and more) for display at Starfest. I remember going to a convention in LA where they had an entire wardrobe display from various SF themed shows. Starfest also hosts a RoboCon during the convention where fans can see robot builders (including NASA robots on display).
There is a huge difference between a speaking fee and an autograph guarantee. Mountain-Con never paid a speaking fee. A lot of times if you just ask someone who you would like to have as a guest they could make arrangements with you. All you needed to do was ask. The autograph guarantee just told the guest that they will come home with a minimum amount for their efforts. Yes Mountain-Con had to pay a guest or two for some autographs (which the con got to keep to try to recoup costs later) but it was MUCH MUCH cheaper than a speaking fee. Another thing that actors loved about smaller cons is that they could come and participate with the fans. They were treated like proper GOH and not just someone shuffled into a corner (which would happen at larger cons). In 2011 I was still getting inquiries from actors about coming because they heard how well their friends were treated at past Mountain-Cons.
Also for the record, the autograph guarantee never caused any financial hardships for the con. If you want to look at the culprit that hurt the most it would be the last banquet.
Subject: Fan club liaison
ReplyDeleteDisclaimer 1: My thoughts on this position were formed when I learned from the two Fan Club liaison gurus, David Powell and Heidi Wessman. I served with both of these people during the early years of Conduit as the FCL.
Disclaimer 2: Martin, I know you held this position recently for Conduit. I do not know what training, expectations or documentation you were given on this position by Conduit leadership. Do not take these comments personally since I don't know if you were filling Conduit's expectations or not.
The only person who will work harder than the Fan Club liaison (FCL) will be the ConChair. (Another position I've also held for three years) A convention volunteer has a great enthusiasm to make the convention succeed. A fan club volunteer has a great enthusiasm to make the fan club succeed.
A FCL needs to be able to talk and understand both sides of the fandom coin. The FCL needs to be constantly networking with groups, attending meetings of the groups, talking with these groups and gathering their ideas and concerns. While meeting with these groups the FCL needs to be the face of the convention. Letting the clubs know how the con can help them and their organization. Then the FCL needs to be the representative for the clubs back at the convention meetings. Championing their ideas to the convention and letting the con know what the clubs would like to see. Working with other convention chairs to resolve any questions and kinks that may come up.
Those who are in club leadership participate in a ton of meetings and prepwork for their club. With real life duties they have limited time for fandom events. Thus the FCL can help them out by being their eyes and ears at convention meetings.
As you can see, the FCL position would take a lot of leg work and conversations. This should be happening all year long. It may be advisable that the person holding the position not be in any other major positions.
It is a lot of hard work, but if done properly it can pay off for both the convention and the fan clubs. A Fan Club liaison has to sell the con to the clubs and show the clubs what the draw is for them to attend the convention. And by being the cheerleader for the fan clubs at the con meetings, the clubs can contribute ideas and suggestions to the con.
I do not post these things to scare off potential liaisons. Being forwarned and forarmed will help a volunteer decide if they can handle the position and help all areas of fandom.
I can only hope that something constructive comes of all of this.
ReplyDeleteMy biggest concern with Conduit. I have no emotional involvement with the con any more. It died years ago for numerous reasons. The guest list disappoints me (I can't even name who the 2011 guest was other than some mystery/romance author), the panel list bores me (even after trying to make suggestions to help), the events hold no interest (another ice cream social?), I don't meet clubs any more at the con to network (their interests are not met), I'm not seeing anything new at the con (too many repeats of worn out ideas). The way I view Conduit now is that it is a glorified three-day writing workshop (with the same subjects from the previous years) that has a side room for gaming and the filkers get to sing after hours. I don't even view it as a convention. LTUE Symposium part II?
ReplyDeleteI know a lot of people work hard towards this event. But I don't see it as anything I'd like to pay money to attend. If it is fun for you, then go for it. But then don't wonder why others don't show up. This con isn't on the radar for a lot of people because of what it offers (or lacks). I know the Trek clubs tell their members that Conduit is coming up, but since the con doesn't sell itself to Star Trek/Star Wars/Firefly/Stargate/etc. fans, they have no desire to attend.
So like Erin said, does Conduit want to be saved? Or do they think it's just fine now? The organizers seem to think it is fine. So I don't have a problem with that. I have fond memories of Conduit over ten years ago when I did have fun. I have a faint hope that Conduit would return to that level of fun some day. However I'm not the person who runs Conduit so the committee will have to decide that for themselves.
Perhaps another Con/Fest/Expo will start up that fills the needs of the common fan. Until then I hope the writers have fun at their workshop.
I have attended CONduit for about the past ten years. While I consider myself to be a fan, I have not been involved in any planning, administration, etc of the con beyond appearing in costume during TV remotes to publicize it, due to work and family obligations. As an outsider looking in, I've found it odd that with multiple Star Trek and Star Wars (Rebel, Imperial, and Merc!) Fan clubs in the area that there isn't a LOT more involvement from those groups. I went to Anime Banzai two years ago, and there were literally HUNDREDS of folks dressed up and having fun. I love the musical events; I love the hall costumes and the Masquerade; I love the media rooms and trivia contests and the swap meet, and the art show and the Dealers' room. I love bringing my kids. I love spending the weekend with fellow fans. Because of the "Capes" theme this year, I came Saturday as Batman with my kids as Batgirl and Robin, and I was pleased to meet other fans in comic book-related costumes too :-) I love the idea a previous poster had of a Comics Expo, or a mini Trek con. There has GOT to be some way to get the Star Trek, and Star Wars, and Comic and Anime fans out en masse to make CONduit even more successful in the future. Again, as an interested fan on the sidelines who appreciates the work that all the volunteers do to put CONduit together, I am hungry for more :-)
ReplyDeleteCarl, you hit the nail on the head... the LTUE symposium syndrome comes from letting the same people run both events. I tried to prevent this as Programming Chair for CONduit XX, I offered to be programming Chair for CONduit XXI... but unfortunately the deck got stacked in favor of LTUE II. If that is what the organizers want, thats what they will have. I would be willing to go back and make one more effort; but some major changes need to be made for that effort to be worth my time.
ReplyDeleteFirst and foremost is a recognition that a change in culture is needed. There needs to be a firm statement that CONduit is not a LTUE event and major organizers need to pick one event or the other. If you want to staff a writing symposium, go volunteer for LTUE... if you want to run a fan-convention, help with CONduit...
I can't recall voting (or even discussing) a Guest of Honor list for the last three years. It used to be a highlight of the Con-Com schedule and all of the fan community was notified and asked for their suggestions. This went away sometime and needs to be brought back.
CONduit and the Salt Lake Public Library used to have a very nice symbiotic relationship in regards to the GoH. This disappeared several years ago when we lost a key volunteer. Nobody else even tried to keep that relationship going. That needs to change. I believe that both Salt Lake City and Salt Lake County libraries would be approachable to build a similar relationship.
Can CONduit be saved? Yes, I think it can, but to save it, it needs to be saved from itself. I unfortunately am working the day of the June Con-Com meeting; however, I am willing to step up and pitch-in again; I just can't lead the charge.
First off I would like to thank Erin from the bottom of my heart for starting this conversation and giving it a home.
ReplyDeleteAs a fan I am depressed at what CONduit has become. Utah deserves a general interest fan convention and I feel that CONduit has wandered far from it's heart and no longer fits the bill.
As a volunteer and committee member from year one, I am frustrated by the stagnation, complacency, and negativism that I now see in ConCom and I have sat quietly by in frustration too long.
As a trustee appointed to look after the welfare of the convention I have been idle too long. I saw the loyal fans at CONduit this year and resolve grew that action must be taken for their sake.
I will take up arms, unfurl my pennant, and tilt windmills for my lady fair. I will find a way for fandom to grow and thrive or fall bleeding on the battlefield.
The Doctor is dead, long live The Doctor!
Brad Hawks
also... be afraid, be very afraid.
ReplyDeleteDon't think I haven't be taking notes on who has been saying "I'd love for there to be change"
Don't be surprised when you get a phone call ;-)
Brad
Greetings,
ReplyDeleteI had the pleasure to attend this years Conduit.
I will say from the start, I had no interest to attend. Last one I attended was 15 years ago, give or take.
One of my friends convinced me to go and just to have fun. Now, a bit of a backstory. I am the team leader of the ERT - Ghostbusters. We are the other Ghostbusters group in the area. So, my friend thought that me getting dressed up and bringing my car to the con would be fun.
Now, I had fun being introduced on Fox 13 with Big Buddah and getting interviewed by Sector 5. The most fun I had was volunteering. I go to cons more to help and meet new friends then to really see panels or guests. I have done this at several con, not just this one.
So, after all of the reads, I can understand both view points, cons can get stagnated by those in charge.
Some believe, if the formula is working why change, well that might be a good thing, but people will get sick of the same taste.
I am always under the belief, change is good, but do it slowly. The con is a bubble effect, to much push in either direction and it will pop.
I have already volunteered for next Conduit and even mentioned a couple of items my group would be willing to help on.
Anyone wants to find us or me, feel free on facebook.
-Robert "Buma" Aswin
Team Leader
ERT - Ghostbusters
PS -> Would have loved a space to park the car and attract more people. :P
They need to rethink what's needed to retain and nurture new people.
ReplyDeleteIt's easy to feel threatened by change or simply be made uncomfortable by it. The person that seems to want to remake the convention is not necessarily going to make people who have run the convention for 20 years comfortable! New people are not necessarily going to be easy to work with-after all, if they were they'd be like what you're used to . . . and if its like what you are used to then its not different and new. I remember when the idea of selling a Con T-shirt made a lot of people uncomfortable but Mike O. pushed for it and it worked.
On the subject of new. I think you could have a dance off between the different fan groups in costume. That would be cool.
I brought up an issue of intellectual elitism in a previous post. This is not just a CONduit issue, this is a general issue. As the writer of parody filk, I have heard the statements that "oh, parody is easy" or "someday you'll write your own songs." I see this same attitude amongst writers and web comic artists. Some writers, artists or musicians are more successful than others... not necessarily better. Really look at what people spend their money on and think about if financially successful equals good art.
ReplyDeleteThe single most commonly produced category of writing in the fan world is fan fiction. No, it isn't all good, but neither is all original fiction. We already have a parody category for the filk contest. I suggest we add a fan fiction short story category to the writing contests. That way the people who truly excel in this type of writing can be rewarded for their efforts.
Robert,
ReplyDeleteThe car attracting people is a great idea. Arranging for visible parking of specialty vehicles is something the convention could arrange with the hotel. I doubt very highly doing so is beyond the skills of a knowledgeable Hotel Liaison. I know that there are several fans who have vehicles that have been modified to their fandoms. People like cars and really like unusual ones.
As a general Sci-Fi fan, I'm rather disappointed in where CONduit is going. As Carl said, its become more or less a glorified 3-day writing workshop. I didn't know a guest from an attendee for the past two years, and I'm losing interest in many of the panels.
ReplyDeleteThe fist year I went the masquarade had a great bounty of participants, and now its dwindled to about ten. The swap meet this year was poorly planned, it should be held on Friday or during the morning on Saturday when it doesn't interfere with other events. The dealer's room has become a gothic jewelry store mixed with books, I couldn't find anything in there I was willing to spend more than $5 on.
If this convention is to continue, or become better, changes must be made. Reach out to those groups who have left. Give them a reason to come back. Please, if nothing else, expand the horizons to those who don't sit around all day reading fantasy novels. I feel lost and uninterested with how things have become. Get some actors, even if its John Doe who played Security Officer #3 in Star Trek in 1968 or something. If CONduit continues down the path its currently on, it will die. I want to prevent that.